Trauma or Genetics: What Actually Creates a Narcissist? Featuring Dr. Salerno

Kerry McAvoy, PhD December 8, 2025
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Is narcissism caused by trauma or genetics—and what does the science actually say? In this episode, Dr. Peter Salerno returns to unpack the controversial research on heritability and narcissistic personality traits. We challenge the most common assumption—“they’re like this because of bad parenting”—and talk honestly about what genetics may explain (and what it doesn’t). You’ll learn why this topic has been minimized for decades, and how that affects treatment, accountability, and your recovery choices. We also discuss what “born this way” doesn’t mean: it doesn’t erase harm, and it doesn’t obligate you to tolerate abuse. If you’ve been trying to make sense of why they’re like this, this conversation will clarify a lot. PODCAST EXTRA EXCLUSIVE SEGMENT Find the exclusive second segment and weekly newsletter here: https://substack.com/@breakingfreenarcabuse MORE ABOUT THE PODCAST EXTRA INTERVIEW 🔹 Stuck in cognitive dissonance? Are you struggling with the decision to leave and wondering why you can’t? Dr. Salerno reveals why waiting for certainty keeps you trapped, how to make the hardest decision of your life without knowing if it's "right," and why almost no one regrets leaving once they do.  👉 Get immediate access to this extended interview: https://substack.com/@breakingfreenarcabuse MORE ABOUT DR. PETER SALERNO Instagram: @DrPeterSalerno  YouTube: Dr. Peter Salerno Website: drpetersalerno.com  Books: The Nature and Nurture of Narcissism - https://amzn.to/3X0athZ Traumatic Cognitive Dissonance - https://amzn.to/4o8yqif Cruelty by Nature- https://amzn.to/3M9k1Vt DR. PETER SALERNO is a retired clinical psychologist with an expert understanding of personality pathology, narcissistic abuse recovery, and the genetic components of personality disorders. With advanced certifications in treating cluster B pathology and extensive training in personality disorders, Dr. Salerno has dedicated his career to helping survivors understand the neuroscience and genetics behind why narcissists behave the way they do—and why change is so extraordinarily difficult. Through his research, clinical work, and social media presence, he challenges long-held assumptions in psychology and empowers victims to set realistic expectations based on science, not hope. ******************* FEELING STUCK? Take my FREE “Toxic or Troubled?” survey to discover your relationship type and get instant access to a complete, private mini-course—educational overviews, reflective questions, grounding techniques, and new strategies tailored to your situation. ▶ Start here: https://kerrymcavoyphd.com/toxic-or-troubled-survey/ READY TO TAKE THE NEXT STEP? • First Steps to Leaving online course – A step-by-step plan to safely and confidently leave a toxic partner: https://kerrymcavoyphd.com/course • Toxic-Free Relationship Club – Weekly group coaching, monthly book reads, access to past webinars, and Dr. McAvoy’s full online course: https://kerrymcavoyphd.com/club/ • Group Programs– Healing Strong, Relationship Reset, and more: https://kerrymcavoyphd.com/ STAY CONNECTED & SUPPORTED • Weekly “Breaking Free from Narcissistic Abuse” Substack newsletter – Insights, stories, and tools for your healing journey: https://breakingfreenarcabuse.substack.com/ • Follow Dr. McAvoy: - YouTube: @kerrymcavoyphd - Instagram: @kerrymcavoyphd - Facebook: @kerrymcavoyphd • Email: [email protected] • Website: https://www.breakingfreenarcissisticabuse.com/ READ MY STORY “LOVE YOU MORE: The Harrowing Tale of Lies, Sex Addiction, & Double Cross” Available now: https://amzn.to/3NVMBXO ABOUT DR. KERRY McAVOY Kerry Kerr McAvoy, Ph.D., is a psychologist, author, and expert on cultivating healthy relationships, deconstructing narcissism, and understanding complex trauma. A survivor herself, her memoir “Love You More” offers an uncensored glimpse into the dynamics of narcissistic abuse. DISCLAIMER: This channel provides all content, resources, and services for educational and informational purposes only. They are not intended to substitute for professional therapy, counseling, medical treatment, or legal advice. Viewing or engaging with this content does not create a client-therapist relationship. If you are experiencing a crisis or mental health emergency, please call 911 (or your local emergency number) or seek immediate help from a licensed professional. 0:00 - Introduction: Are Narcissists Born or Made? 0:51 - Why Genetics Feels Painful 4:02 - The Warrior Gene Example 7:34 - Polygenic Conditions Explained 10:45 - Bad Genes Don't Exist 14:10 - Why Change Is So Difficult 19:59 - Hope vs. Reality: Practical Implications 22:46 - Early Intervention Can Change Brains 29:04 - Can Narcissists Actually Change? 30:06 - Are Some People More Vulnerable? 36:18 - Walking Away With Ambivalence 38:26 - Body Wisdom: The Airport Story 46:30 - Where to Find Dr. Salerno

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